In a recent episode of “American Thought Leaders,” host Jan Jekielek sits down with Paula Scanlan, a former University of Pennsylvania swimmer and teammate of transgender swimmer Lia Thomas. Scanlan has become an outspoken advocate for banning biological men from women’s sports.
Jan Jekielek: You were interviewed anonymously for the documentary “What is a Woman?” Recently, you decided to say who you are and make a statement. How did this happen?
Paula Scanlan: I was approached to be on “What is a Woman?” when I was still in college and competing on the UPenn swim team. People from all sides were going to talk about gender ideology, and they needed representation from athletes.
It was scary to speak about my experience at UPenn while I was still a student, so I decided to go anonymous. I wasn’t courageous enough at the time to identify myself. But last year I decided the right thing was to speak the truth and be comfortable putting your name behind the truth. I started doing these interviews, and here I am.
Mr. Jekielek: When did you notice something weird happening on the team?
Ms. Scanlan: In the fall of 2019, we were told that a member of the men’s team was transitioning to the women’s team the next season, but the next season was canceled because of COVID. It was two seasons later that a member of the men’s team was on the women’s team and in the women’s locker room. Until then, I had hoped it wouldn’t come true or that the rules would change, but in the fall of 2021, it was happening, and there wasn’t much I could do about it.
Mr. Jekielek: In 2019, when this idea came up, had anything been changing? Had there been hints of a new policy?
Ms. Scanlan: I hadn’t heard anything. When we were first told this, I looked up the rules and saw that a year of hormone replacement therapy was required. I wasn’t quite sure what that even entailed. At that point, I started to see that the NCAA [National Collegiate Athletic Association] policies were deeply flawed, that they didn’t take into account skeletal structure, muscle mass, lung capacity, heart size, and other factors that differentiate men and women.
And when we started talking about the policy and how it wasn’t fair, people began throwing out the word transphobic. I never thought that pointing out that men and women are different would classify as hate speech. But that was happening as I questioned more.
It was actually more about questioning authority by saying, “Maybe the NCAA is wrong” or “The university is wrong,” or “The system is wrong.” When you raise those questions, that’s when they start labeling you as a hater or a transphobe.
Mr. Jekielek: You mentioned the locker rooms. Please explain that situation.
Ms. Scanlan: When this member of the men’s team, formerly Will Thomas, announced the transition, we weren’t sure if he was actually going to be in the locker room with us. In his year of hormone replacement therapy, Will was still competing for the men and changing in their locker room. Once the transition took place, it happened every day that we changed in the same locker room.
Mr. Jekielek: What was the reaction of the women?
Ms. Scanlan: A lot of girls changed in the bathroom stalls so they would be completely covered. Some brought it up to the coaches, but were told that if someone’s part of the team, they deserve the same privileges as everyone else. In their defense, that actually makes sense. If we’re going to say Lia is part of the women’s team and she’s a woman, why wouldn’t she have the same rights as the rest of us?
It’s consistent, but definitely not the right thing for women. There was never much of a discussion about that.
Mr. Jekielek: What about the competitions themselves?
Ms. Scanlan: At the beginning of the season, we weren’t sure how fast everyone was going to swim. The Ivy League had canceled all sports for the 2020 to 2021 school year, so there weren’t any swimming competitions.
So, we weren’t really sure who was fast and who was slow, because a year off is a lot of time. But the first meet we swam against Columbia, it was obvious that Lia was going to be a very dominant swimmer. She destroyed the competition in these events.
Mr. Jekielek: How were your teammates dealing with this situation?
Ms. Scanlan: At first, you could have conversations with anyone on the team. Some people said, “I don’t care that much about the locker room, but I don’t like losing my spot on the relay.” Someone else would say, “I don’t like that the record board is now going to have Lia’s name,” or “I don’t like that Lia is able to score points against other teams.”
When Lia broke a bunch of records in December, it became a huge national story. That’s when the university had their first meeting with us as a team.
This meeting put us in shock because they brought in a bunch of specialists. A member from the LGBT center told us we were going to have mandatory meetings with the center. They brought in psychological counseling. That was scary, because in my mind, that’s almost equivalent to re-education. It really showed me that they wanted us to think differently, and not just help us be comfortable with the situation.
Mr. Jekielek: What’s next for you?
Ms. Scanlan: I want to help bridge the gap on this issue. A lot of left-leaning and right-leaning individuals oppose these policies. We need support from all sides.
We should also protect people who don’t have voices, like younger girls. We don’t know if their sports are going to be affected by this. That’s the biggest thing: giving a voice to people who don’t have a voice.
This interview was edited for clarity and brevity.
